Zell Wolf GWF Zell Wolf Version VII-2: REBIRTH Night 1 / Day 1

[Jawneh]

Random or guaranteed? Random, right?

I'll probably be chilling in my own nice little corner before outing any information. I don't remember what game it was, but I vividly remember one game where it looked fairly bad for the town as the wolves were picking off all the guaranteed roles. I don't want any of that again right off the bat.

 

[Smacktard]

I'll probably be chilling in my own nice little corner before outing any information. I don't remember what game it was, but I vividly remember one game where it looked fairly bad for the town as the wolves were picking off all the guaranteed roles. I don't want any of that again right off the bat.

You realize saying whether you're guaranteed/random also gives the saving roles targets on who to protect, right?

The plan works if the town cooperates, but if the town doesn't cooperate, it puts wolves at a massive advantage when they can use confusion wolf, make two kills, and then claim those same roles.

 

[Jon]

The last time I tried the teamwork route I had to commit suicide.

 

[Cole]

Well in that case, I ask that you hold out just until tomorrow to vote for me. By that point, I can prove I'm a random role.

That is, as long as you're not lynched by then, wolfie.

there's a lot of things you could do in one night. that seems like a big ask. why should I trust you?

 

[Smacktard]

there's a lot of things you could do in one night. that seems like a big ask. why should I trust you?

Because, as opposed to you, I'm actively working in the interest of the town.

 

[Smacktard]

SUS list so far (most to least sus):
Cole
TD
Jon
Benzine
Dean
Jawneh

 

[Dean]

Lol like 5 or 6 people haven't even made a meaningful post yet and you're doing a sus list

You do you

 

[Jon]

I've said three things in here and that puts me third on your sus list? I'm not sure I'm following this logic? Please assist me

 

[Dean]

I've said three things in here and that puts me third on your sus list? I'm not sure I'm following this logic? Please assist me

Well, they admitted they needed help with math, so...

 

[Smacktard]

I've said three things in here and that puts me third on your sus list? I'm not sure I'm following this logic? Please assist me

Is your role random or guaranteed?

 

[Smacktard]

Lol like 5 or 6 people haven't even made a meaningful post yet and you're doing a sus list

You do you

Yes and they're already less sus than you

 

[Dean]

Kelly's hostility doesn't necessarily make him sus to me, especially after he almost singlehandedly took out the predators in Aussie Mafia with his super chlamydia scratching powers

 

[Cole]

ladies and gentlemen here you have an example aggression that is TOO aggressive. Kelly is so very desperate to be the one in charge this game.

I wonder if that's because he knows the survival rate of the person that "takes charge" in these games. a lot easier to direct traffic as a wolf if you're the "lead townie". if he survives today, he'll claim his role tomorrow, and it'll also be perfectly viable that the wolves could have done whatever he claims.

even if he kills, he'll just use confusion to mask who don it.

we've seen that strategy before.

 

[Dean]

Yes and they're already less sus than you

I like to think I put the sus in tiramisus

 

[Dean]

ladies and gentlemen here you have an example aggression that is TOO aggressive. Kelly is so very desperate to be the one in charge this game.

I wonder if that's because he knows the survival rate of the person that "takes charge" in these games. a lot easier to direct traffic as a wolf if you're the "lead townie". if he survives today, he'll claim his role tomorrow, and it'll also be perfectly viable that the wolves could have done whatever he claims.

even if he kills, he'll just use confusion to mask who don it.

we've seen that strategy before.

I think he either has a strong role with serious powers or is a wolf. He's demonstrated that he can be an aggressive player when he has a role worth the aggression.

 

[Smacktard]

ladies and gentlemen here you have an example aggression that is TOO aggressive. Kelly is so very desperate to be the one in charge this game.

I wonder if that's because he knows the survival rate of the person that "takes charge" in these games. a lot easier to direct traffic as a wolf if you're the "lead townie". if he survives today, he'll claim his role tomorrow, and it'll also be perfectly viable that the wolves could have done whatever he claims.

even if he kills, he'll just use confusion to mask who don it.

we've seen that strategy before.

Desperate gambit to regain control of the narrative. You're being anti-town and wilfully illogical (but only with certain, pro-town things), and you're trying to turn the town against someone who said they can prove their role by tomorrow.

What's your gameplan here? Die by end of day?

 

[Jawneh]

You realize saying whether you're guaranteed/random also gives the saving roles targets on who to protect, right?

We already got stupidly lucky that someone protected the right person and there was no kill. Unless there's a random doctor, that's -1 protection already. From the current guarantees, that's a witch potion or tough guy charge gone. If others want to claim, they can.

And to be fair, it has served me perfectly well to not say anything about my role until it's time. Sure, there's always an unprotected target on my back, but also considering how I play, I could be full of hot air and hoping to be a target.

The plan works if the town cooperates, but if the town doesn't cooperate, it puts wolves at a massive advantage when they can use confusion wolf, make two kills, and then claim those same roles.

We got a ritualist. The disadvantage would vanish after a day.

 

[shortkut]

As soon as you read this, say whether you are a random villager or a guaranteed villager.

Do not say your specific role.

If you do not claim, you will be lynched.

Why?

• Forces wolves to decide day 1 what their soft "role" is; can't change mid-game
• Makes it easier for town to find wolves by splitting them into two groups
• Completely nullifies power of confusion wolf
• Game is stacked against town. They have a guardian wolf so can thus waste a day, meaning it will likely be 9v6 by the time we can successfully lynch (at best)
• We have to vote together as a town. No waffling, no changing votes unless actionable info comes out, no splitting votes.

And for god sakes Ritualist, I can't believe this has to be said, but don't revive a bad guy.

Guaranteed villagers:
Vash

Random villagers:
Alu
Smacktard
Tubby
Local (?)

No claim/delayed claim:
Benzine
Dean
TD
Jon

Refuses to claim:
Cole
Jawneh

dong ding:
@Kat
@Raine
@Raposuh
@shortkut
@Tommy Boy

(Sorry for tagging everyone. Had to make sure everyone saw. YOU still love me.. right? Someone?... Hold me ;_

I’m still reading page 1. Did you go back and edit after people answered you?

I’m townie but I don’t know if my role is random or guarantied because I refuse to read the role dictionary more than absolutely necessary

 

[Smacktard]

We got a ritualist. The disadvantage would vanish after a day.

Yeah, unless the Ritualist revives a wolf -- and that's kind of the point behind this exercise too -- to make it less likely that the Ritualist would do so.

 

[Jawneh]

Dammit Kelly, stop distracting me from my duties for a moment. It's already been like 2 hours.

Voting Benzine.

 

[Smacktard]

I’m still reading page 1. Did you go back and edit after people answered you?

I’m townie but I don’t know if my role is random or guarantied because I refuse to read the role dictionary more than absolutely necessary

oh okay well I guess we can remove shortkut from the SUS list, he said he's not a wolf.
(yes I did edit afterward)

 

[TD]

Random or guaranteed? Random, right?

I'm just gonna say it.

Getting people to out that they are a guaranteed role is basically giving the wolves a hit list.

Remember the last game when the wolves targeted exclusively guaranteed roles?

Yes role claiming matters but giving the wolves a list of people they can kill without hitting the randoms they will likely hide within is not a good idea.

 

[Dean]

"No, thank you" is what I should've said
I should be in bed

 

[Smacktard]

Remember the last game when the wolves targeted exclusively guaranteed roles?

Didnt Zell say that the counter to this was exactly what I'm proposing now?

I find it really suspicious how, in a game where multiple people typically overtly hint at their role by end of day one, people are suddenly very wary about saying whether they're guaranteed or random.

Strong roles hide amongst random roles too, and the guaranteed roles are not that strong this game, especially considering one of the protections has already been used up.

You're offering justifications for denying the town info, which doesn't seem in character for you. The town will have less info as the game goes on, so now is our best shot.

 

[shortkut]

voting @Smacktard

This is not the most optimal strategy for learning everyone’s roles. You should say something that rhymes with your role or sounds like your role… or be executed. For example, in @VashTheStampede ‘s most recent mafia game, I was the stray leaf

 

[TD]

Didnt Zell say that the counter to this was exactly what I'm proposing now?

I find it really suspicious how, in a game where multiple people typically overtly hint at their role by end of day one, people are suddenly very wary about saying whether they're guaranteed or random.

Strong roles hide amongst random roles too, and the guaranteed roles are not that strong this game, especially considering one of the protections has already been used up.

You're offering justifications for denying the town info, which doesn't seem in character for you. The town will have less info as the game goes on, so now is our best shot.

I'll save everyone the trouble: 2 guaranteed roles are the only instance where one of them can exist. You could have the other 14 come out and say random.

What does this accomplish?

Specific roles help. Asking everyone to claim guaranteed or random without role specifics does not.

I'm not denying the town anything. I've already voted for someone I believe to be a wolf.

Your protection strategy is not good. We have two guaranteed protection roles to exist - both are a single time use and one of those may have already been used.

 

[Smacktard]

voting @Smacktard

This is not the most optimal strategy for learning everyone’s roles. You should say something that rhymes with your role or sounds like your role… or be executed. For example, in @VashTheStampede ‘s most recent mafia game, I was the stray leaf

So, just to recap:
give town info but don't say role = BAD
Give wolves specific infovbu saying your role = GOOD
Voting for me after I asked for a single day's delay in order to give myself time to prove my role = GOOD

This is the most sus logic yet.

I change my vote to shortkut.

 

[Cole]

Desperate gambit to regain control of the narrative. You're being anti-town and wilfully illogical (but only with certain, pro-town things), and you're trying to turn the town against someone who said they can prove their role by tomorrow.

What's your gameplan here? Die by end of day?

my plan literally every game involves me dying at the end of the day. why do you need control of a narrative anyway? aren't you on the town's side?

how do you plan to prove your role in a way that is 100% guaranteed? kill someone? what if they're protected. read someone? what if they're shamaned? protect someone? what if they're berseked.

how are your grand claims going to be authenticated?

Didnt Zell say that the counter to this was exactly what I'm proposing now?

I find it really suspicious how, in a game where multiple people typically overtly hint at their role by end of day one, people are suddenly very wary about saying whether they're guaranteed or random.

Strong roles hide amongst random roles too, and the guaranteed roles are not that strong this game, especially considering one of the protections has already been used up.

You're offering justifications for denying the town info, which doesn't seem in character for you. The town will have less info as the game goes on, so now is our best shot.

can you please for the love of god stop quoting Zells strategy as gospel.

 

[shortkut]

So, just to recap:
give town info but don't say role = BAD
Give wolves specific infovbu saying your role = GOOD
Voting for me after I asked for a single day's delay in order to give myself time to prove my role = GOOD

This is the most sus logic yet.

I change my vote to shortkut.

Do you not pay attention to any previous day 1? Day 1 means throw shit against the wall and see what sticks.

Keeps vote on smacktard for being dense or obtuse

 

[Smacktard]

You could have the other 14 come out and say random.

If the town plays bad, the town deserves a loss. It's in the town's interest to say guaranteed/random. If most people claim random, then that's where we start looking. And it gives the Ritualist a better target.

Specific roles help. Asking everyone to claim guaranteed or random without role specifics does not

Yeah: it helps wolves decide who to kill, and which roles to claim.

Your protection strategy is not good. We have two guaranteed protection roles to exist - both are a single time use and one of those may have already been used.

Exactly why guaranteed roles are not necessarily stronger.

 

[TD]

If the town plays bad, the town deserves a loss. It's in the town's interest to say guaranteed/random. If most people claim random, then that's where we start looking. And it gives the Ritualist a better target.

You're still not saying what this accomplishes.

If 2 people come forward and say guaranteed, while 14 come forward and say random - what have we really accomplished?

 

[Dean]

Do you not pay attention to any previous day 1? Day 1 means throw shit against the wall and see what sticks.

Keeps vote on smacktard for being dense or obtuse

That's gimmick infringement, brother

 

[shortkut]

That's gimmick infringement, brother

Sorry, I should have voted him for being a dumdum

 

[Smacktard]

how do you plan to prove your role in a way that is 100% guaranteed? kill someone? what if they're protected. read someone? what if they're shamaned? protect someone? what if they're berseked.

how are your grand claims going to be authenticated?

It's really not that hard to figure out, Cole, but it requires that the town acts in good faith.

If someone claims guaranteed and is killed by confusion wolf, we can assume that that was a guaranteed townie, narrowing the list and placing more focus on the wolves. As soon as all guaranteed roles are proven/dead in some way, any wolves who claimed to be guaranteed would be outed and killed.

It helps the village home in on wolves, which is exactly why do many wolves right now are shitting themselves over it.

 

[Smacktard]

You're still not saying what this accomplishes.

If 2 people come forward and say guaranteed, while 14 come forward and say random - what have we really accomplished?

As a town? Played badly.

 

[TD]

As a town? Played badly.

...you realize I'm pointing out the strategy you are proposing - right?

 

[shortkut]

I feel so discombobulated without @Ants! or @Fool's Requiem . Day 1 is supposed to start with me voting @Ants! and probably switching to someone else and day 2 needs to have me voting for @Fool's Requiem for being a dumdum

Continuing to vote for @Smacktard for helping the wolves plan their strategy if he isn’t wolf aligned

 

[Smacktard]

...you realize I'm pointing out the strategy you are proposing - right?

I don't recall suggesting that the town lie about whether they are guaranteed/random, and that is the only way that the town could ever end up with 14 people in random, so I don't see what backwards logic this is.

 

[Smacktard]

I feel so discombobulated without @Ants! or @Fool's Requiem . Day 1 is supposed to start with me voting @Ants! and probably switching to someone else and day 2 needs to have me voting for @Fool's Requiem for being a dumdum

Continuing to vote for @Smacktard for helping the wolves plan their strategy if he isn’t wolf aligned

You still haven't given a valid reason how denying the confusion wolf the element of confusion and narrowing wolf targets is a bad strategy

You've also voted for me after I voted for you (lol)

And you admit that you're more willing to vote for a non-wolf than a wolf.

You just broke my sus-o-meter

 

[TD]

I don't recall suggesting that the town lie about whether they are guaranteed/random, and that is the only way that the town could ever end up with 14 people in random, so I don't see what backwards logic this is.

The only roles you can claim as guaranteed and it actually be useful are Warden & Ritualist. The other 4 on the list fall into the Random pool.

You've also now perfectly outlined what the wolves should do by broadcasting this strategy.

You're either the fan or misguided. Which is it?

 

[shortkut]

You still haven't given a valid reason how denying the confusion wolf the element of confusion and narrowing wolf targets is a bad strategy

You've also voted for me after I voted for you (lol)

And you admit that you're more willing to vote for a non-wolf than a wolf.

You just broke my sus-o-meter

You do you boo

 

[Jawneh]

Yeah, unless the Ritualist revives a wolf -- and that's kind of the point behind this exercise too -- to make it less likely that the Ritualist would do so.

Unless it's Raine again.... Okay, maybe even she won't do it again. But I think we learned from that game that it's not a good idea. Not matter how entertaining it is. Knowing people's role pool doesn't even help the ritualist beyond rolling the die between 6 or 4 roles. With 6 wolves scattered in the mix. The ritualist needs to tag a person before they die anyhow, so there's less nothing to worry. There's no solo killers, so the wolves wouldn't be randomly dying either unless a marksman, witch, or other folks kill them off. At that junction, the town should have some kind of a consensus on who might be sus.

You might be pushing a good idea, but you gotta give some better reasoning to get anything from me personally.

 

[Smacktard]

The only roles you can claim as guaranteed and it actually be useful are Warden & Ritualist. The other 4 on the list fall into the Random pool.

Sounds like the sort of thing you should've pointed out after people claimed their roles, but instead you're signalling to the wolves what they should do. Curious, couldnt you just do that in wolf chat? Unless...

You're either the fan or misguided. Which is it?

Ah yes yes, projection.

You've also now perfectly outlined what the wolves should do by broadcasting this strategy.

No, this was you.

 

[Kat]

Remember the last game when the wolves targeted exclusively guaranteed roles?

In the first game I played, I was a wolf, and we were able to kill the medium due to people claiming roles. The sorcerer can help them find or avoid killing specific roles, they may even have a wolf seer in addition to that. It's risky IMO.

Ugh everyone stop posting so fast, I barely start writing and more pop up.

 

[Jawneh]

Getting people to out that they are a guaranteed role is basically giving the wolves a hit list.

That's what I said. We got down to every one dead except the randoms. And... wait, was it the illusionist game?

 

[shortkut]

Sounds like the sort of thing you should've pointed out after people claimed their roles, but instead you're signalling to the wolves what they should do. Curious, couldnt you just do that in wolf chat? Unless...

Ah yes yes, projection.

No, this was you.

Or it’s both of you

 

[TD]

Sounds like the sort of thing you should've pointed out after people claimed their roles, but instead you're signalling to the wolves what they should do. Curious, couldnt you just do that in wolf chat? Unless...

You mean when I stepped away - and came back to you trying to lead this bizarre strategy?

But sure - prove you're serious. Add another vote to sus #3 on this list of yours.

 

[Smacktard]

Remember the last game when the wolves targeted exclusively guaranteed roles?

Refresh my memory, was that a game that the wolves won? Was that a game in which people claimed whether they were random/guaranteed?

 

[Local Hero]

I've got no opinions so far. A lot of strong personalities so far for sure

 

[Kat]

I don't recall suggesting that the town lie about whether they are guaranteed/random, and that is the only way that the town could ever end up with 14 people in random, so I don't see what backwards logic this is.

So if someone has a role that's on both lists, do you want them to say guaranteed or random?