Zell Wolf Zell Wolf Rebirth (Just kidding, you're dead)

[Zell 17]

If it makes you feel better @TD I get the feeling your game is ending only a tiny bit earlier than everybody elses

 

[TD]

I do hate that the natural course of the game seems to tend to make people want to quit.

I do think you were a dumb person to target for berserk but obviously it worked swimmingly so what do I know

I think it just gets tiring when it feels like players are getting targeted as opposed to roles getting targeted.

The way I play - I also go back in night phases to try to figure stuff out so it gets discouraging to consistently get killed so early. This was the first time I wasn't going to bother but then got jailed with Kelly.

When I told Kelly I didn't feel like going back and reading the day I meant it at that point, but I still wanted to try to help.

 

[TD]

Makes sense, take out the three most feared players. I get that.

The fact that I committed suicide doesn't change that. I just took out the player I fear the most.

...I also said you were my protection target (I was going to keep kill roles safe), but evidently even if I wasn't jailed I couldn't protect you from yourself.

 

[VashTheStampede]

...I also said you were my protection target (I was going to keep kill roles safe), but evidently even if I wasn't jailed I couldn't protect you from yourself.

Story of my life

 

[VashTheStampede]

I do think in the future with any type of removal power I'm going to focus on people who sit on the sidelines and criticize strategies without participating and putting their own forth.

I know my selfish misstep likely cost the town the game immediately in this one. At least with the above philosophy I can feel justified in fucking things up for the others.

 

[TD]

I mean to be fair there was a lot of fucking up and it's not all on you - but 3 of the last 4 games the town lost because of being way too passive and it's happening again this game.

 

[VashTheStampede]

That was another reason I convinced myself to pull the trigger lol

Oh well. On to the next one.

 

[TD]

That was another reason I convinced myself to pull the trigger lol

Oh well. On to the next one.

Out of curiosity who did you line up for shot 2?

 

[VashTheStampede]

Smacktard

 

[TD]

Smacktard

I'm curious if he's actually the Librarian. He claimed it to me in jail too. I was inclined to believe him.

He could technically be the Fan, but I just don't get that vibe.

 

[VashTheStampede]

I'm pretty sure he is the Librarian.

 

[TD]

Wait who's the Ritualist?

I thought FR but just realized he's not in the game. lol

 

[VashTheStampede]

I've been bad too much in these games lately. Instinctively killing good people now lol

 

[VashTheStampede]

Wait who's the Ritualist?

I thought FR but just realized he's not in the game. lol

Benzine I think

 

[TD]

I've been bad too much in these games lately. Instinctively killing good people now lol

Even good players get bad streaks.

Fwiw I was happy you jumped back onto Local.

 

[Raine]

Just like Alu is always a wolf, fucking Benzine is always the goddamn necromancer.

Raine do you still want the conversation between the jailees?

It's probably fine since Smacktard is alive, but curiosity and nosiness is piqued.

I do hate that the natural course of the game seems to tend to make people want to quit.

I do think you were a dumb person to target for berserk but obviously it worked swimmingly so what do I know

This is me every game, in both directions.

"This is going to be amazing, I'm a genius" -> it blows up horribly -> "OH LAWD LOOK AT THIS MESS "

"There's no way these people can fight their way out of a wet paper bag" -> they effortlessly steamroll someone -> "...Huh. Well I'll be damned" and dead because it was probably me lol

 

[VashTheStampede]

Even good players get bad streaks.

Fwiw I was happy you jumped back onto Local.

Not shopping for sympathy or anything, I've come to terms with it, but I honestly don't think I'm a good player, I think I just started with some beginner's luck.

And thats fine, because it's still fun.

I do think I'm pretty good at running games though

 

[TD]

Not shopping for sympathy or anything, I've come to terms with it, but I honestly don't think I'm a good player, I think I just started with some beginner's luck.

And thats fine, because it's still fun.

I do think I'm pretty good at running games though

At the end of the day as long as it remains fun that's what matters the most.

You're a fantastic host though.

 

[TD]

"This is going to be amazing, I'm a genius" -> it blows up horribly -> "OH LAWD LOOK AT THIS MESS "

This resonates too much with me right now. When I came clean I thought the town would at least collectively agree to take the chance based on someone who I felt was obviously bad, and at worst incredibly suspicious (I suspected at the time of accusation but when I saw how it played out I was convinced).

Whenever I jump back in, that's not a mistake I will repeat.

 

[Raine]

Yeah, minimally both me and Kelly laid out why someone needed to die in order to keep momentum. Alas, the smallest bit of doubt (or, uh, lack of Power Role I suppose) - even with no Fool presence - and the town goes limp. Every time.

Cole prodding definitely shot him to the top of my personal suspects list. Intended to toss him and Kat into the brig Night 2.

Amusingly, @Zell 17 forgot to put the "During the day" part into the Warden's description. So I tried putting 4 and 5 (shortkut and Kat) into prison Night 0. 2/2 on wolf kills! Albeit with the benefit of having two targets per night.

 

[VashTheStampede]

This resonates too much with me right now. When I came clean I thought the town would at least collectively agree to take the chance based on someone who I felt was obviously bad, and at worst incredibly suspicious (I suspected at the time of accusation but when I saw how it played out I was convinced).

Whenever I jump back in, that's not a mistake I will repeat.

It's tough to be told "I got you a puppy" and then be told "okay well I meant you might get a puppy for Christmas" and not feel like you were lied to by an evil malicious force.

 

[TD]

Cole prodding definitely shot him to the top of my personal suspects list. Intended to toss him and Kat into the brig Night 2.

I think there's at least a good possibility that Kat is the converted fan or a wolf (which is hilariously lucky for them to hit the fan Night 0 if so). If so, maybe you still die.

I was excited at first when I saw I was jailed - but then disappointed it was Kelly after I closed the phase saying I'd kill Local myself if I was locked up. Heck, there's 4 I would've killed with no hesitation, Local, Rapusah, Cole, and Jon.

The fact they used fucking berserk to kill the Tough Guy? Something had them concerned about me.

Oh well. One day I'll have the power to kill as a townie.

 

[Raine]

I think there's at least a good possibility that Kat is the converted fan or a wolf (which is hilariously lucky for them to hit the fan Night 0 if so). If so, maybe you still die.

Distinctly possible, for sure. But I mostly just signed up as fodder to begin with, since I don't have enough time at the moment to really play "properly." Acting as a surrogate Seer for the Ritualist wouldn't have been a bad out, either.

I was excited at first when I saw I was jailed - but then disappointed it was Kelly after I closed the phase saying I'd kill Local myself if I was locked up. Heck, there's 4 I would've killed with no hesitation, Local, Rapusah, Cole, and Jon.

Yeah, I was already asleep by the time that post happened.

Sent the PM for you and Kelly at 3:46 PM ET, did a secondary "if TD gets lynched, then..." follow-up at 7:13 PM. Backups were Benzine and Jawneh, since at the time (while I was making the vote log table) I noticed a post from Benzine that seemed to be saying he was a Seer. Alas, later revealed to be a joke between the two - but I'm always up for killing Jawneh anyway.

The fact they used fucking berserk to kill the Tough Guy? Something had them concerned about me.

I'll be very curious to hear why they did this, for sure. If they specifically used the Sorcerer (or have an RRV Wolf Seer I guess) to see you were Tough Guy, and then Berserked just to get rid of you... I mean again it worked out in the end, but not something that's going to be worth it in most scenarios I think. The town almost strung you up, thinking anyone sane was going to protect you is a reach.

 

[TD]

Distinctly possible, for sure. But I mostly just signed up as fodder to begin with, since I don't have enough time at the moment to really play "properly." Acting as a surrogate Seer for the Ritualist wouldn't have been a bad out, either.

I didn't really have the time to play properly either so maybe should've avoided signing up. I got home and there was like 10 pages or something and I didn't really have the time nor patience to go through it all so I really only looked at my quote and mention notifications.

 

[Raine]

Likewise. I eventually got through Page 5, and I did the Ctrl+F "vot"-ing, but wasn't/couldn't pay enough attention to catch claims. Certainly not like my last game. It was kind of nice, in a way.

Would've been super pissed if I had put in the time and wound up dead though, so I feel ya.

 

[TD]

I just peeked, I spent about two hours while jailed with Kelly investigating and discussing from 11pm to a bit past 1am.

Reminds me of when you resurrected me.

 

[Raine]

Big oof.

I can't tell if me or wolf is worse for your health and sanity.

 

[TD]

Big oof.

I can't tell if me or wolf is worse for your health and sanity.

kidding

 

[Fool's Requiem]

Wait who's the Ritualist?

I thought FR but just realized he's not in the game. lol

I'm actually the Shadow Wolf. Always in the shadows. So much that not even the wolves know I exist.

 

[TD]

I finally looked at the thread.

I'm rooting for Dense and Dangerous.

Post in thread 'GWF Zell Wolf Version VII-2: REBIRTH Night 2 / Day 2' https://gwforums.com/threads/gwf-zell-wolf-version-vii-2-rebirth-night-2-day-2.1027/post-61271

EDIT: I read the rest. Dean is playing well and doing good to take the lead.

 

[Fool's Requiem]

I haven't bothered looking at the thread recently. Hard to keep up with things, so I just don't bother.

 

[TD]

It was the first time I looked for this day phase, it started off real ugly, but Dean took the reigns and seems to be on the right track but it may not matter. The town is going to need a lot to go right with the witch kill, protections, and Ritualist spell - especially with a Guardian wolf and potential Alpha (I mentioned in another game this happened that it's a ridiculous combo).

A game with 6 wolves and that combo? Fucking ridiculous if it exists and stacked in the wolves favour. It effectively means you gotta kill 8 wolves unless the Guardian is killed by a night kill pre any wolf lynch. It's technically not over but.. yikes?

 

[Raine]

It's offset somewhat by the Fan, to be fair. Honestly the town has (had lol) a decent array of blocking and killing potential, and still has an okay amount.

The more I think about it (which isn't a whole hell of a lot honestly), the less Kat being the Fan makes sense to me. Like if she were truly hit Night 0 - why say anything? To debunk your Tough Guy claim that the wolves would know wouldn't pan out anyway? But if Local is a wolf, and therefore ostensibly the Alpha (if Tommy isn't a wolf)... it doesn't matter. And the Guardian being primed still makes it moot, too. It's muddying waters where waters don't really need to be muddied.

I mean if Cole's a wolf then, sure, yeah, Chaos and shit. And he's definitely a wolf. But even for him this seems... contrived. There's Chaos and then there's doing so many donuts in the parking lot that your wheels pop off.

 

[Zell 17]

It was the first time I looked for this day phase, it started off real ugly, but Dean took the reigns and seems to be on the right track but it may not matter. The town is going to need a lot to go right with the witch kill, protections, and Ritualist spell - especially with a Guardian wolf and potential Alpha (I mentioned in another game this happened that it's a ridiculous combo).

A game with 6 wolves and that combo? Fucking ridiculous if it exists and stacked in the wolves favour. It effectively means you gotta kill 8 wolves unless the Guardian is killed by a night kill pre any wolf lynch. It's technically not over but.. yikes?

This is true, but its not guaranteed. And the town IS guaranteed 4 bullets. Three of which obviously are already gone.

I don't think the'yre gonna get a lynch

 

[VashTheStampede]

If I would have gotten Priest instead of Marksman we would have won.

I would have been making charts and doing straight up FBI profiling to get that Castlevania badge

 

[Raine]

I don't think the'yre gonna get a lynch

Doesn't seem likely.

I could hazard guesses for why, but folks seem to be variously opposed to the idea of making mistakes and letting others down.

I fucking resurrected a Solo Killer, guys. It's okay to make mistakes! ...I mean I contend that in particular wasn't a mistake but you get the idea.

 

[TD]

The more I think about it (which isn't a whole hell of a lot honestly), the less Kat being the Fan makes sense to me. Like if she were truly hit Night 0 - why say anything?

I mean objectively it didn't make sense to go Berserk on the Tough Guy either - even if it did ultimately work out. So who knows. (I also never realized Berserk could steamroll through Tough Guy, lol). I was trying to signal nobody to protect me too.

The biggest thing I wonder is if Kat did it so people don't worry about the win condition thing. It's a big impact if the town thinks they are dealing with 5 instead of 6. Admittedly when I was glancing it over and trying to catch up without my usual time to analyze, it didn't cross my mind at first but then eventually it did. Not that it matters now.

This is true, but its not guaranteed. And the town IS guaranteed 4 bullets. Three of which obviously are already gone.

I don't think the'yre gonna get a lynch

Yeah losing the Warden and Marksman in one night was ROUGH.

Even if they agree on a target, it's a townie they die, if it's a wolf - it's a Guardian, so yeah. No lynch.

 

[TD]

I fucking resurrected a Solo Killer, guys. It's okay to make mistakes! ...I mean I contend that in particular wasn't a mistake but you get the idea.

I think it was Kat who mentioned in the Morgue of Vash's game that people are afraid to make mistakes because of ridicule that has happened in the past. This shouldn't be a thing. Even the best players make mistakes. It's just a game.

 

[Raine]

I think it was Kat who mentioned in the Morgue of Vash's game that people are afraid to make mistakes because of ridicule that has happened in the past. This shouldn't be a thing. Even the best players make mistakes. It's just a game.

Understandable, and yeah.

So all I'm hearing right now is that I should sign up for every game and make the most "well-intentioned" mistakes possible so everyone else has more breathing room.

 

[TD]

Understandable, and yeah.

So all I'm hearing right now is that I should sign up for every game and make the most "well-intentioned" mistakes possible so everyone else has more breathing room.

This is why I regret backing down on my move.

I should have doubled down and pointed out the voting patterns that led me to my list of 6.

If I have more time to play this time around I probably do but like I said earlier, I missed 10 pages and didn't have a chance to analyze.

 

[Zell 17]

I mean objectively it didn't make sense to go Berserk on the Tough Guy either - even if it did ultimately work out. So who knows. (I also never realized Berserk could steamroll through Tough Guy, lol). I was trying to signal nobody to protect me too.

The biggest thing I wonder is if Kat did it so people don't worry about the win condition thing. It's a big impact if the town thinks they are dealing with 5 instead of 6. Admittedly when I was glancing it over and trying to catch up without my usual time to analyze, it didn't cross my mind at first but then eventually it did. Not that it matters now.

Yeah losing the Warden and Marksman in one night was ROUGH.

Even if they agree on a target, it's a townie they die, if it's a wolf - it's a Guardian, so yeah. No lynch.

Town strategy here is pretty simple. Vote to lynch any wolf. Force the guardian to use power. Witch kills a wolf. Hope during the night that either the witch protects, a RRV protects, or that the ritualist spells the wolf kill.

If the wolves get a kill, the next day would be 6 v 5. Lynch a wolf. That night you need the witch or a rrv to protect someone, it’s too late for the ritualist.

 

[TD]

Town strategy here is pretty simple. Vote to lynch any wolf. Force the guardian to use power. Witch kills a wolf. Hope during the night that either the witch protects, a RRV protects, or that the ritualist spells the wolf kill.

If the wolves get a kill, the next day would be 6 v 5. Lynch a wolf. That night you need the witch or a rrv to protect someone, it’s too late for the ritualist.

Yeah it's simple on paper but they gotta get the right people and need a bit of "luck" for it to happen.

I'm pretty surprised Dean, Benzine, and Tubby haven't made a plan to avoid protection/spell overlap at this point.

 

[TD]

I just looked at the game thread again and I kinda wish I didn't.
lol

Tommy's not the real seer because he called TD Good and Local Unknown.
Rapusah's the real seer because he called Kelly Good and Alu Evil.
Oh and Cole's suspicious.
Kelly and Alu are voting Raposah.
Cole voted for Tommy.
You know what we should do? Vote for Tommy.

 

[Raine]

I do feel like people are missing the glaringly obvious fact that half the players are intentionally acting in bad faith because that’s their role.

If they aren’t making sense, they’re probably Ee-vil!

 

[Fool's Requiem]

I don't make sense lots of times, and not just when I'm evil.

 

[TD]

Caught up again, surprised they agreed finally.

Alu and Kelly got to the right conclusion but for the wrong reason. lol

They keep saying I was killed for saying I would kill Local if locked up with him, but this came with less than 30 seconds left in the phase which means the Warden would've had to be actively keeping up with every post as they came in and was able to jail me in a matter of seconds before the day ended - and I wasn't jailed with Local.

I can't believe this is the conclusion they've drawn. It was simply meant to reinforce how I felt about Local.

 

[TD]

Well they pulled off step one of.. many.

 

[Zell 17]

The Ritualist is here. Well, not really, he's asleep, but he has access

@Benzine

 

[TD]

I loved when he called himself "Cuntzine".

 

[Fool's Requiem]

Benzine, how do you always get the Medium type role?